Oh no I have to go back to work!
Anyways…
Quiet unionizing?
we should fucking hope. Might catch on
Dude… you’re getting “or else.”
And Dell said “Great, thanks, saved us a ton on severance packages and allowed us to replace our high paid tenured employees with hungry graduates who are prepared to work themselves to death for peanuts”
Truth.
Been job hunting in similar fields for a while and as a middle-aged person, I simply cannot get a callback from any of these companies, then when you actually visit them and see some of their workforce, you rarely see anyone over late-20’s, and it’s all these high-energy, eager-to-please, eager-to-work-for-recognitionbucks, fresh-outta-college kids who can be exploited and turned over rapidly.
I am job hunting because the previous company I managed was bought out, downsized, and all the senior employees making more than entry level wages were cut. This is happening everywhere.
More and more technology, overseas outsourcing options, and general service/gig systems for filling job openings has left companies treating workers as disposable as toilet paper.
This is because almost every business is now part of a huge chain of ownership, and the shareholders at the top, groups of very rich old white dudes, just gather together in their hooded cloaks and look at the bars and graphs every month and decide what investments are to be amputated, and which to be kept. Before going back to their private sex islands.
High paying jobs with tons of new graduates have an oversaturated supply problem. It’s no surprise that when people figure out that becoming a software developer is easy street to 150k+++ WFH that there was a huge rush to get those jobs… now that there are TONS and TONS of young junior devs there is no shortage to hire someone for near minimum wage.
Why pay 400k for a senior developer when you can hire a mid-level for ~100k to be a manager, and 4 juniors for 60k a piece, and augment them with chatgpt to help them learn what they are skill gapped by.
Plus junior devs are so desperate you can force them to come into the office, something the dev divas ten years ago refused to do back when there was a huge shortage of coders.
Absolutely correct, I watched this happen to our tech team before I was also thrown in the chipper.
And it doesn’t help that a lot of the young people trying to get into coding and tech fields are not what you would call titans of confidence and charisma, these are mostly introverted and thoughtful people who have studied most of their lives under the belief that meritocracy exists, and they can prove themselves in the business world by doing great work and being a good employee.
Meanwhile glance over at the sales side of the building and there are people there making six figures a year who do next to nothing but party and tell lewd jokes, but are absolutely invulnerable to layoffs and downsizing as long as they can talk to clients and joke about sports with the CEO.
The disillusionment around the business world is real and unsustainable.
God my last sales team were annoying. You can hear their bullshit from the floor above. They never shut up.
I had the misfortune to have to share an office with a bunch of sales morons. I can recommend Bose idiot-cancelling headphones. What a bunch of selfish noisy fuckwombles.
Every job I’ve had I’ve ended up becoming a liaison of sorts between the sales teams and the operational teams because I seem to be the Daywalker, who can walk between worlds and communicate with the techy nerds, take their issues to the loud sales assholes and make it all work.
It’s not an enjoyable role but it always earned me high marks because nobody else can stomach it.
I would like live in this world. We are trying to hire, and it’s basically as hard as ever. Senior developers are super hard to get, or even to talk to. Even if you pay above average rates.
There’s plenty of “LinkedIn senior” developers, tho. But after 3 years of C they can’t explain a static variable or can’t define a promise claiming to be js experts.
It’s like seeing the Dracula myth reborn. They periodically come to wreak great violence, but always draining. Always unseen. Always feeding.
and this is why we are going to have a surge in enshittification in every piece of software and engineering around. eagerness and high energy does not replace decade of experience and ability to hold your composure against corporate pressure to do shady shit (if anything eagerness to please enable it)
Since the shareholders only care about 6-month projections, they will always choose a shitty, short-term successes with rushed products with patches later or promises of continued bugfixing, than spending more money and time to make something that users approve of and passes all requirements.
The shit is already running pretty deep.
who are prepared to work themselves to death for peanuts
…while having no idea what they are doing
That’s not this quarter’s problem, silly!
That’s a problem for next months Me to fire you for!
Yeah that’s the next CEOs problem.
Your move, Bitch!
Others said their local offices had closed since the pandemic
This part is wild. So they closed down the office and then punish the employees for not coming into the office. Tell me this is illegal.
Good.
In my case, it was pretty effed up and I know some of yall are going to dislike this comment. When covid hit, I was instructed by the CTO to put a plan together to quickly make every employee remote accessible to the organization. Upon completing this project (took roughly 3 weeks since majority of employees were working off laptops and only needed to increase our VPN license count - gotta love Cisco), people were asked to work fully remote and if they needed to come into work, they just needed to send an email for approval from their manager to come into the office the following day.
When an employee comes into the office, at the entrance they had to either show their vax card or get their temperature checked, if the employee had a vax card, they were allowed to go to their assigned desk to work, if you did not have a vax card and didn’t have a high temperature, you were sent to a designated area of the building to work from, you were allowed to go to your desk to get any belongings you’d need then come back to the designated area.
After 3 months of this, the company had a new policy, all employees must be vaxxed in order to enter the building, no exceptions. If the employee worked remote, no problem you weren’t required to be vaxxed. The CTO tells me that I need to communicate to the entire IT team that we will now be RTO (returning to office) permanently, this included project managers… IT is a set of departments that majority can easily work remote. A small portion could come into office to do any hands on work but because the hands on work was done within a specific region of the building it would require these employees to be vaxxed and to provide proof of it. So the CTO decided instead of targeting a small handful of IT professionals, he would just get the entire IT team to get vaxxed and come back into office permanently.
I told the CTO that I don’t plan to get vaxxed, I’d rather ride it out. And that other team members felt the same. The CTO gave me an ultimatum. I told him I will send out an IT wide email but that’s the only command I will obey. Flat out, CTO tells me anyone who doesn’t get vaxxed will be terminated. So I and 4 others got terminated two weeks later.
And now, companies around the U.S. are getting sued for their employer-imposed vaccine mandates.
Last laugh, bitch.
Glad you got fired. Vaccines should always be mandatory save for legitimate, doctor-validated medical exemptions.
Anti-vaxxers are fucking stupid and should either be educated properly or, if they still refuse to do their civic duty after being de-programmed of misinformation, punished. You are only allowed to participate in society if you take the necessary steps that you are morally and ethically obligated to do in order to protect it from preventable, transmissible disease. We had eradicated polio until stupid motherfuckers like yourself decided that it would be a good idea to forgo the standard polio vaccine schedule that we’re had for decades. Now, we saw the first case in 30 years in 2022 because someone selfishly thought that their personal beliefs were more important than the health and livelihood of everyone else.
I understand your anger and agree that anti-vaxxers are stupid. I believe public health education should be part of the school system.
I also agree that it’s responsible for a society to impose reasonable restrictions on members that endanger it.
I think people do have an ethical obligation to take reasonable precautions avoid potentially exposing others to pathogens. Vaccination is an example of reasonable precaution. People have the right to bodily autonomy, do not vaccinate them against their wishes.
I do not support the firing of workers for refusing vaccinations if they can do their job remotely. People shouldn’t have to decide between their religious beliefs and employment if their employment doesn’t bring them into contact with others. (Imo anti-vaxx is essentially a religion, this may say more about my beliefs regarding religion than about anti-vaxx sentiment).
By all means exclude the unvaccinated from places where they can be reasonably understood to endanger the public, or others that have a similar right to be there.
Yeah, me too. In the end it turned out great for me and my family. Literally that job in the Bay allowed us to save even more money allowing us to buy a large property. And if all goes the way we hope, I can eject myself out of the job market and enjoy life with my fam. No more wage slave life.
Pssst… people were still getting the flu after their vaccines, after multiple vaccines. You know what the flu did to me? Literally, lost of taste. I couldn’t taste salt for about 4 days. Happened twice only, thankfully. I’ll personally take that a million times over.
Stay salty, brah.
Big “seatbelts kill” energy
Bragging about not helping others isn’t the flex you think it is. :(
getting sued for their employer-imposed vaccine mandates
The only case I’ve seen succeed is for a company that ignored legitimate religious exceptions. Have you seen any successful cases that support your use case?
There’s ongoing class action suits in the U.S., I don’t know when that information becomes public.
ROFL
This is your brain on Facebook.
I dont… use social media. This and telegram are the closest thing to social media I use.
He said, on social media.
I thought we’d moved beyond this sort of nonsense.
I dunno, you lost your job for no good reason. Did you sue?
Kinda seems like they have the last laugh.
And most likely any job will require proof of a vaccine. OP fucked around and is finding out. But yeah the companies being sued
Nah… after leaving the org in the Bay area, I joined a new org this Jan… it’s no longer the terrorist we thought it was.
I believe it was a blessing. One door shut, another one, a few months later opened. I had to move from Southern California to the Bay… where my salary was a little more than 1.5x the previous salary and this company, a video game developing company, interestingly, didn’t have such requirements in order to work there or come into office (it was like 90% remote work, only came into office to work on projects with my team).
Nope, they didn’t have the last laugh. Good thing I didn’t sign the NDA either at the time of termination.
NDA’s are legally unenforcable anyways. You know what’s totally legally enforceable? Shunning plague carriers. Lmao I honestly hope you get out of yout typhoid mary phase before you kill someone you care about, but we all wish bad things happen to bad people.
NDAs are very much legally enforceable lol. A nitable time they aren’t, is if there has been illegal activity the NDA is trying to compel you to keep secret.
You still get infected…
Wait a minute, are you people under the impression that the vaccine protected you from getting covid and spreading covid?
Is that what’s happening here?
Sure call me a plague carrier, but my blood is clean. Yours? haha
It’s not about completely preventing infection, you can still get infected. It’s about minimizing the odds of infection and lowering severity when infected, to mitigate transmission as much as possible. It’s more about society as a collective and less about the individual. You can ride it out, sure. But if you pass it along to someone who can’t, then what?
That’s how virus carriers work. Blood clean of any way to stop the spread. Lmao gimme that muddy bloody soup full of every antibody known on this planet. My body is full of legions of Rambo mfs looking to fuck up any intruder on sight. Your blood is an open field with a welcome mat and a bottle of wine. My infection is killed off in hours while yours sets up a nice summer home to come back every year.
You know where clean bloodlines end up? On headstones.
That’s cool… I rarely get sick though. And for something like the flu? I rather depend on my immune system. Maybe when I’m 60 or 70 years old. Or when I get sick more frequently, I’ll take medication more seriously.
Vaccine deniers are a truly interesting breed. Do you just not have a full grasp of biology or are you too busy getting in your head about some shit you made up?
- Covid has more than 10x the mortality rate of common flu
- even without vaccine you still have an immune system, but not as ready against covid, and you spread it for a longer period which can be fatal for those around you, especially older people or people with a bad immune system
I don’t get what you people have against vaccines. They saved millions of lives over the years and the causation is clear beyond any doubt.
You are te proof that the education system sucks.
That’s a horribly deceiving title. They just stayed remote and made themselves ineligible for promotion.
Business Insider claims it has seen internal Dell tracking data that reveals nearly 50 percent of the workforce opted to accept the consequences of staying remote, undermining Dell’s plan to restore its in-office culture.
ineligible for promotion
This seems like an empty threat to me. Every promotion I’ve ever gotten internally has come with a negligible pay increase (~4%). The best promotions I’ve gotten have been leaving to take a new job somewhere else (~20-50%).
And that 4% just buys you a year before inflation cuts it back down again. Searching for a job from home is easier.
Lol, more a hope than a plan
Promotions haven’t been worth it for 30 years. Most people stick around cuz it’s a PITA getting a new job
If promotion means becoming a manager… no thanks.
I went from doer to manager, even though I’m now expected to do and manage… it isn’t enjoyable.
Can confirm. ^^’
Though I am just going to resign on Monday and give myself the push.
duuuude get a new job before you quir the old one
Only if he still has any fucks to give
Or bills to pay. Or mouths to feed.
If they think about those, there are still fucks left to give.
That would be the dream, but it hasn’t panned out, and my long notice period is hampering me. I’m not going to continue slogging it out here indefinitely, and I don’t need to.
I don’t need any additional anxiety to discourage me from getting out of this before I just burn out and am in a worse position.
I saw a handmade sign in a floating workshop for ships, it stated “Please Resist Entropy”. That has inspired me ever since. It sounds like you are resisting entropy and good for you. Wish you better times and a better job. o7
Fuck the notice lol
It’s contractual, I’m going to serve my notice period.
fair enough, and I’m sure you know what you’re doing. I’ve always felt that I’m in a much, much stronger position saying I’m employeed but I’d prefer to work for you rather than them suspecting that I just need some job, any job ya know
anyway, hope you work it out
Good luck! Everything will work out eventually.
Man these sensational titles for articles have been setting such a deceiving narrative. I feel like I’m in a veiled world since like 2015
Probably while updating their resumes and looking around for replacement jobs in case they find a better one. I know I would.
As intended. A Layoff by any other name…
I wonder if this method doesn’t overproportionally eliminates valuable workers, who can easily switch companies.
Sounds like a problem for the next CEO. I got quarterly metrics to meet. When shit hits the fan cause all the talent left I’ll just eject with my golden parachute.
Pretty much.
Capable employees don’t raise a huge stink.
They quietly put the word out to a few people they know and play along until something interesting appears on the horizon.
Then when they’re good and ready they just “suddenly” fuck off to somewhere nicer for them.
Not for 50% of the company though. They’re going to have a rough couple years ahead of them.
That’s consistent with my office, plus a hiring freeze so nobody new coming in.
Fortunately, for me, my cardiologist told them to pound sand. Working from home now since 2018.
Good luck getting people to waste a ton of gas and time going into the office every day. Even before the pandemic, everyone was already using teams for meetings virtually. I think we had physical meetings a few times a year at most, and even then, some people were virtual.
Lolbruh. Go ahead and tell me to go to the office 5 days. I’ll peace the fuck out.
I peaced out at 2. Manager was a bit of a prick, and the office was bright, hot, cramped, loud, and had no visual or audio privacy.
No fucking thanks.
Found a job thanks to my peers and it’s a little more pay and 100% remote as per the union contract. Wheeee. Work anywhere in the country.
Work anywhere in the country
can you remote while out of the country?
The problem is taxation for the employer usually. But you can become self employed and pay your taxes locally as your own employer and invoice your sercices to the company you work with.
This is what I did some years ago without moving borders.
There’s a pretty good chance that every employee facing this offer is in a position where Dell sees them as replaceable. They want people who follow orders and not much more, so if you want to look at it through that filter Dell got what they wanted.
Unless somebody over there at the top is crazy, Dell would have had individual deals with the true innovators, decision makers, movers and shakers internally who are viewed as top tier and irreplaceable.
What happens if you refuse both options?
That’s called “time to get a new job.”
Before I came in here, I assumed that’s what “or else” meant, and I’m still not sure it doesn’t mean that.
Can you be fired for conditions they decided to change?
In most US states, you can be fired for any reason that isn’t explicitly illegal.
In the USA, if it is not explicitly written in your job description/contract that you are remote, yes. It also means you can’t apply for unemployment as you were terminated for refusal to perform work duties, even if you are working.
In the US, yes, in most states. If you’re not following company policy, even if that changed since you started, that’s not wrongful termination unless it’s for “unfair labor practices” or something. Employment contracts don’t really exist unless you’re a contractor.
I had one of those at my job. They fired him.
Dell announced a new return-to-office initiative earlier this year. In the new plan, workers had to classify themselves as remote or hybrid.
Those who classified themselves as hybrid are subject to a tracking system that ensures they are in a physical office 39 days a quarter, which works out to close to three days per work week.
Alternatively, by classifying themselves as remote, workers agree they can no longer be promoted or hired into new roles within the company.
Holy corporate oppression, Batman! That’s a shitty deal no matter which option you choose.
I’m glad they’ve got themselves into a sticky situation.
Also, this observation was funny (in a sad way):
One person said they’d spoken with colleagues who had chosen to go hybrid, and those colleagues reported doing work in mostly empty offices punctuated with video calls with people who were in other mostly empty offices.
One major downside of hybrid working really is that if you are having a meeting where even a single person is not there, then the entire meeting may as well be a video call. If you are on a video call, then why do you need to be in the office for it?
At my job we work with physical objects, so being in office is a requirement at least part of the time, but if I’m just going to be in meetings for most of the day, there is no way I’m going into the office just to sit on video calls all day.
So you could just got he the office days straight and don’t show up for the rest of the year… interesting… but considering promotions are everything but lately i’d just go remote anyway.
You mean to tell me, three days a week, they have to:
- wake up extra hours early
- pack a lunch or plan to pay for one
- put on hard pants
- drive their own vehicle in traffic, with their own gas and wear/tear
- pay for their own parking.
- do the exact same work in their designated space
- drive back home in traffic 9 hours later
All for the same pay and several hours away from my family, home, or bed?
No fucking thanks.
Going remote was the best fucking raise I ever got, and it didn’t cost them a dime.
