Gets complicated when you have empathy for plants too. 👀
Raising non-human animals ends up taking more plants anyway because they eat a lot of feed who’s energy is mostly lost. So if one were concerned with plants, eating plants directly results in fewer plants being killed
If your goal is to minimize the overall harm to plants through your own consumption the most ethical thing to eat is people.
Billionaires 🤤
In glad we got to the bottom of this. People. People is the right answer, everyone.
That’s a load off my mind! Let’s start a company. Maybe we can name it after what we’re saving. Something like… Soylent green?
Only if they are consenting?
As others have mentioned, eating fruits and fungi don’t kill the organism, and per my understanding it’s the same for vegetables where you pick something off the plant to eat
But if that were the argument, then you don’t need to be vegan, but vegetarian. Milking a cow doesn’t kill it.
I personally think that the animal exploitation argument is the strongest for veganism or vegetarianism, not any of the ones appealing to some naturalistic rule or that no organism should be exploited. Yes, animals provide humans a very efficient nutritional source that plants can’t give us, but a) we stopped eating the majority parts of animals that are not meat, and b) that doesn’t justify animals raised in cruelty, without any regard for their wellbeing, standing in their own feces all day and so on.
Our current scientific understanding of plants is that since they don’t have a nervous system, they can’t feel pain. And that while they react to stimuli (facing the sun for example) they don’t exhibit any form of consciousness. Unfortunately there have been more and more claims to the contrary, but not backed up by studies.
I complete agree that veganism is about reducing animal pain, suffering and exploitation. Personally, I think if you’re taking care of your chickens and cows like they’re almost pets, then there’s nothing wrong with eating eggs or drinking milk. That’s how my ancestors used to get their produce, from their own chicken or cow, which were treated well and humanely. They didn’t eat the meat of those animals, but other animals though 👀 I want to be vegan eventually, but I like the idea of symbiotic and humane relationships with other animals
I have some bad news for you about the dairy industry in that they very much do kill cows. Cows producing milk requires producing constantly impregnating them. That means a lot of babies, only some of which are female and produce milk. They’re seperated from their mothers and if male, killed because they’re seen as waste (and would use the cow’s milk because that’s who the milk was meant for). Then female cows are also still usually killed after there milk production begins to decline because they’re less profitable
Yes: it’s the exploitation that have us kill the cows, not the actual milking. I know some people that are vegetarian but only get their products from a local farm. This is of course very expensive and not an option to many, but it would still be consistent with the moral stance against exploitation.
Wild fruit (e.g. fruit that hasn’t been cultivated though centuries of botany) is trees tricking you to eat its seeds and poop them out in fertilizer. But those seeds tend to be big and wreak havoc with your digestive system.
True Facts gets into all this.
Plant bebes
Involuntary vegan (health reasons) since 2018 here. I thought that I would lose al muscle as a vegan but I haven’t noticed any difference there. What I did notice was vastly increased stamina and much better temperature regulation (not bothered by cold in Wyoming of heat in Florida). This is purely anecdotal, do with it as you wish.
I just happen to eat a vegan diet because I travel a lot and refuse to pay people to do things to animals that I wouldn’t feel morally comfortable doing myself. Maybe if I settle down somewhere, I would find a farm that allows me to personally verify the ethical treatment of the animals. I don’t feel like I’m missing out on anything, though. I’m in great shape, not deficient in anything, and am routinely assumed to be 10 years younger than I am.
From my experience, the people who think meat is required to be healthy usually have the worst diets and are addicted to eating the most low quality processed garbage meat available. It’s never people in good shape that go on and on about how crucial meat is.
If you really go vegan don’t forget to take B12 vitamin supplements. It’s very VITAL and really the only supplement you need if your diet is diverse enough.
I’m really looking forward to cultured meats for similar reasons. I take no issue with one animal (human) hunting another wild animal to eat its meat for sustenance - that’s just biology bro - but our farming practices have just become insanely abhorrent with regards to animal ethics. I can’t wait until some bioengineer makes my minced meat in a lab with no animal cruelty involved because while I hate torturing animals, I love me some meat.
In the mean time, there’s all kinds of great plant-based meats and such along with just making other good dishes without any plant-based meats. If we just continue to wait for cultured meat, harm will continue to be done
That’s totally fair, but I generally don’t like to ascribe to the idea that we as individuals need to take on responsibility for solving issues that are systemic in nature. I think anyone doing anything they can to make an impact is great and should absolutely be lauded, but we should never be placing or accepting responsibility for solving these issues onto individuals.
I have coeliac disease, which makes most plant-based meat alternatives off-the-menu because of the use of wheat or barley, so I don’t tend to feel so bad for consuming meat a few nights a week. My body struggles to maintain healthy vitamin levels at the best of times, so I have to compensate how I can and balance the ethics of the matter. I’m also not rich, which means I can’t afford a high-quality vegetarian or vegan diet right now. For someone like me, waiting for cultured meats is the best I can do right now unless a cure for autoimmune diseases is found.
For the gluten part, most of the major plant-based meats are gluten free: beyond is, impossible is, etc. They are also not the only option of course either as dishes don’t need to use any plant-based meats and can say be bean based or lentil based
For the individual part, the problem is that as long as people expect to consume meat, dairy, etc. in mass, factory farming is the invariable outcome. There really isn’t much way away around requiring changes to consumption levels. For instance, something like grass-fed production couldn’t even supply a third of beef production, and would even raise emissions as well
We model a nationwide transition [in the US] from grain- to grass-finishing systems using demographics of present-day beef cattle. In order to produce the same quantity of beef as the present-day system, we find that a nationwide shift to exclusively grass-fed beef would require increasing the national cattle herd from 77 to 100 million cattle, an increase of 30%. We also find that the current pastureland grass resource can support only 27% of the current beef supply (27 million cattle), an amount 30% smaller than prior estimates
[…]
If beef consumption is not reduced and is instead satisfied by greater imports of grass-fed beef, a switch to purely grass-fed systems would likely result in higher environmental costs, including higher overall methane emissions. Thus, only reductions in beef consumption can guarantee reductions in the environmental impact of US food systems.
I don’t really have anything witty to say, but I do just to want to comment and say I really love this.
Wait…
Our comments are supposed to be witty‽
I’ve got to make some calls.
your face has calls to make
witty
Meat-eating gains are stolen valor apparently.
