The posts are ominous.
“Pick a side, or YOU are next,” wrote conservative talkshow host Dan Bongino on the Truth Social media platform in the aftermath of Donald Trump’s 34 felony convictions.
The replies were even more so.
“Dan, seriously now,” one user wrote in response to Bongino. “I see no way out of all this mess without bloodshed. When you can rig an election, then weaponize the government and the courts against a former President, what other alternative is there? I’m almost 70 and would rather die than live in tyranny.”
That’s a common version of how many people on the US right reacted to the ex-president’s verdict, drawing on a “mirror world” where Trump is seen as the selfless martyr to powerful state forces and Joe Biden is the dangerous autocrat wielding the justice system as his own personal plaything and a threat to US democracy.
Calls for revenge, retribution and violence littered the rightwing internet as soon as Trump’s guilty verdict came down, all predicated on the idea that the trial had been a sham designed to interfere with the 2024 election. Some posted online explicitly saying it was time for hangings, executions and civil wars.
pick a side, or YOU are next
So if I don’t a pick a side I’m first in line?
Stupid. Obviously he means pick his side or they’re going to do bad things to you.
His luck; the government has the working tanks.
Guy in a MAGA hat, running: “…the US is under threat…”
Goose, chasing: “under threat by who, motherfucker??”
I’m not really sure it should be up to 70 year olds whether we have a civil war. It’s the young people that will have to live in it’s wake, should it happen.
Don’t forget the generation of radicalized vets from desert wars.
Is there any valid evidence of this radicalization? Anecdotally, I’ve been in the Global War of Terrorism social circles, and they seem to be pretty even with their political distribution, maybe a little more right leaning, but I think that’s due more to lack of higher education than military experience. What I think happens is that the right likes to make logical fallacy appeals, so they exploit radical veterans by giving them a louder voice.
It reminds me of a scene from The Big Lebowski.
Walter Sobchak: Those rich fucks! This whole fucking thing… I did not watch my buddies die face down in the muck so that this fucking strumpet…
The Dude: I don’t see any connection to Vietnam, Walter.
Walter Sobchak: Well, there isn’t a literal connection, Dude.
The Dude: Walter, face it, there isn’t any connection.
Rather than be a rational level-headed support like The Dude, the right exacerbates their struggles to exploit them.
I lived and worked among many over the last two decades. So, just anecdotal experience. https://www.rand.org/news/press/2024/04/09.html
Yeah, it seems like misplaced anger that is masking underlying pain and sadness to me. The right-wing leaders take advantage of their mental health issues for their own selfish goals. It’s disgusting.
That is the story of the right. My father-in-law is sitting on his couch with his drug addicted son, who has never had a job, railing against Hunter Biden. My grandmother is 80 years old and is worried that we are days away from going door to door and pulling Christians out in the street. My mother is full up on social programs and benefits but it’s the “others” that are making her life worse. Mental health issues, sadness, inability of reflecting…lots of excuses.
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Sadly that’s pretty much always the case with war, the youth pay the bill for the elderly
And the poor pay the bill for the rich and powerful.
You can apply that logic to most decisions this country makes.
Why the hell are we letting 70 year olds dictate energy policy? They’re not gonna see the full brunt of climate change.
Why are they involved in foreign policy? They’re not going off to war.
Economics? Most of the people they talk to are retired or rich. tf do they know about making rent in 2024?
Honestly, this may sound controversial… but if we deny teens the vote, I’m not certain why the hell we allow retirees to vote.
Can’t vote for the first 18 years of your life? Can’t vote for the last 18 either (based on average life expectancy), just watch how things improve dramatically if such a measure is put in place.
Same logic with holding elected positions, if people younger than X can’t be elected then people older than (life expectancy - X) can’t either. And yes, I realize that it leaves very few years for men to become president in the US’ case and that’s not a bad thing at all.
Anything that motivates increasing the national average life expectancy is a good thing
You don’t want Bernie to vote?
He can vote a little as a treat.
I don’t want anyone that won’t live with the consequences of their political decisions to be in a position where they get to decide for those who will.
It would mean losing a few progressive voices, but also losing a ton of far right and center right voices and opening the door to people who actually have a reason to care for what’s going to happen in the next 50 years because it concerns then directly.
I don’t want anyone that won’t live with the consequences of their political decisions to be in a position where they get to decide for those who will.
On the flip side, young folks vote influences things like social security and medicare. Given that everyone of all ages is subject to various government policies, often uniquely, you cannot have a system where you can identify a subpopulation that ‘shouldn’t count’ by that logic.
And young folks influence it in their favor for the long term which also benefits people that are currently old instead of old folks pulling the ladder after them.
Some care. Some don’t want their grandchildren to suffer. But right wingers never care regardless of their age. They’re selfish assholes.
To be fair, he did give another option.
FWIW, I know 70some and 80some year olds that can still think critically and know what doom is on the horizon if Orange Satan’s Rectum wins. Intelligence, as well as stupidity, transcend how many years one has rode around the yellow fusion ball.
Their ability to think isn’t what I’m really talking about. No matter what, an 80 year old is writing checks someone else has to cash. Maybe we do need to have a big fuck off war to end these fascist fucks once and for all, but that’s not an 80 year old’s decision, you know?
It used to be the old guided the young into the future. Somehow with the last generation, rather than transition, they’ve vice-gripped the entire system to hold onto the 1950s until their hands are bleeding. I see what you are saying with regards to the decision, and we have seen many of the olds make “fuck you, I got mine” decisions every day. I suppose I was just pointing out that they’re not all bad. There’s just that greedy psychotic vocal minority holding all the keys to shit all over everyone. To solve that? Maybe we do need a big fuck off war. Really wish it wouldn’t have to come to that though. Waiting it out doesn’t even work because modern medicine keeps extending their lives.
I didn’t mean to imply they are bad. I’m fifty. I’m not really including myself in the group of people who should be calling those particular shots, but I also want to be part of the solution and I hope it doesn’t come to that. My grandpa fought in WW2. I don’t want my kids or grandkids to face that. But sometimes the world doesn’t care what we want.
So do you support taking away their ability to vote then?
Not the other commenter, but I could only support that if they are legally proven mentally unfit to care for themselves. I know that is a high bar, but there’s really no good argument for restricting anyone’s right to vote.
I mean - its the press amplifying the opinion of some irrelevant old geezer who’s just calling others to violence. I wouldn’t really concern yourself too much with these idiots.
Honestly, I’m inclined to agree. I also don’t see a way out without bloodshed. Not because I want Republicans to die or think that Democrats are so great that I am ready to die for them, but rather because we have split so far ideologically that I cannot see us ever being united again and we seemingly don’t have any method available for a peaceful divorce.
My personal plan is to leave the country permanently as soon as I retire, but that is 15 years away. I can only hope that things stay somewhat together until then and I will use my vote to try to help it do so.
Where ya planning to move to?
Well, I don’t like hot and humid, so most Asian countries are probably out. Most likely some where in Europe. Depends on the current state of affairs at the time.
What would “bloodshed” achieve though?
Well, historically, civil wars seem to end in one of two ways, either the victor subjugating the loser or the country splitting apart. So I would wager the outcome to be one of those.
Both of those sound so much worse than the current situation though.
As in, to have a decisive civil war everyone has to be certain there’s no alternative, knowing that they may well die in such a war.
Things would have to get a lot worse before that seems like a good idea.
Everyone doesn’t have to decide a war is preferable, just a critical mass. And it probably won’t be a war like you’re imagining, with battles and such, but rather a whole lot of terrorism and assassinations. Only a fool would attack a well-armed group directly when there are so many soft targets all over the place. Most Trumpanzees are dumb as bricks, but there are enough of them with a basic knowledge of military tactics that they won’t just throw themselves into a meat grinder.
It is NOT a good idea, it is NEVER a good idea. However, in order to avoid it, both sides would have to be willing to talk to each other, in good faith, and work out an agreeable way forward. That is what we used to do. We have always been a divided country, but when it mattered both side could usually work out a mutually agreeable resolution. That has stopped. So, we are divided and continuing to split further and no one will work together. What is the resolution? I don’t see a good one any time in the near future.
We forgot to subjegate the south and let them infiltrate our society over 150 years.
Yeah, that was Johnson’s failure.
these victims of indoctrination are so mindfucked as to think they’re going to do a single goddamn thing vs the us military.
after getting nothing done on 1/6 vs a handful of capitol police who mostly stepped aside and ushered them in. good luck, bumpkins. i guess
I think you underestimate the number of military personnel that support Trump. The lack of military or police support as our Congress was invaded was no accident.
It’s probably regional. In Tennessee, within an infantry unit, you might see some support but not total. In suburban areas only a few supporters. Regardless, they risk losing their pay if they turn traitorous which means it won’t happen.
i would think that being in the military would give people even better insight into exactly what someone would have to overcome if they’re fucking dumb enough to decide to go rogue. ‘overcome’ as in the entire rest of the us military. unless you’re getting a significant number of high ranking officers on board, you’re basically going nowhere
Well, the commander in chief at the time was involved in the conspiracy to commit treason. They definitely delayed the military response themselves. I don’t think the President Biden will want such a delayed response this time.
to think they’re going to do a single goddamn thing vs the us military.
Vietnam.
Afghanistan.
What makes you think a civil war outside the military wouldn’t also be taking place inside the military?
I remember watching movies as a kid where the children were these clever little heroes and the adults were morons or bad guys they had to deal with. It’s fun for kids to see the tables turned and watch the children in the movie save the day or outsmart the dumb adult.
I got a very strong vibe like that (but worse) while reading this story. These people are caught up in a fantasy they’ve been sold where they have to save everything they love from evil. They seem to live in a fantasy movie world where if you feel like the righteous underdog, and other “good” people tell you the same thing, then surely you are the hero! You can’t listen to evidence and reason from outsiders, they’re just trying to trick you!
I’m almost 70 and would rather die than live in tyranny.
Go ahead, then, put the barrel to your head and pull the trigger.
Oh, it’s actually about oppressing others and not living under tyranny? Thought so.
And then he drove back to his McMansion in his F-250, hitched up the boat, and went to the lake for the weekend.
Class civil war being instigated by wealthy oligarchs who don’t really care how it happens, but they’re intent on bringing about a coup one way or another. So they amp up the chaos and division and will look to take advantage of it. Right-wingers are being fed a bunch of bullshit and they’re trying to deify Trump, one of the worst examples of a human being in history, and getting pushed to violence to protect a living piece of excrement.
The Justice Dept really needed to come down harder on Trump and everyone else involved in Jan. 6. They showed their cards then and what they’ve been planning all along, we shouldn’t gave given them a second chance.
Merrick Garland was a huge mistake.
The oligarchs don’t want a civil war; they fear it! But they are losing control.
The wealthy instigate the entire culture war and manufacture the propaganda behind it. The wealthy even plan to leave the country for us to kill each other.
At the risk of sounding like a fascist-fucc-boi, I don’t see any evidence to backing the claims that this is an engineered crisis. I don’t doubt it, but making claims like that without evidence and strong linkages is exactly what the right does.
I would suspect that even if it is an engineered crisis, it’s not our own wealthy class doing the engineering. They can have what they want in a more stable way by not having this nonsense happen. It’s not like the democrats are suddenly going to actually start making their lives notably harder. In fact, a lot of the ‘MAGA’ is stuff they would not want (high tariffs when they want to import cheap and sell high instead, abusing immigrants by detaining and deporting instead of abusing them by making them be a cheap labor source afraid to exercise any rights they might have for fear of getting deported).
Foreign interests are about the only ones that stand to gain from this sort of instability.
I’ll just go to the evidence tree where they leave confessions to everything they do. I’m sure they’ll leave a nice summary wrapped in a bow for you.
Or you could read a summary of project 2025
I don’t get why you’re being so hostile, when I just asked a question. ‘just google it, bro’ is the refrain of every Monster Energy slinging, tinfoil hat wearing conspiracy theorist out there.
I will google project 2025, though I doubt I’ll find anything of value; much like any response to this comment you might make.
If you don’t know what project 2025 is you’re either embarrassingly uninformed of intentionally ignorant
I doubt the oligarchs really want a civil war. A civil war would shrink their labor force.
“When you can rig an election, then weaponize the government and the courts against a former President, what other alternative is there? I’m almost 70 and would rather die than live in tyranny.”
- Ivan, Moscow
I guarantee there are some genuine conservative asshats who fervently hold that belief.
Probably, but I wouldn’t expect them to be able to spell half those words.
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One thing to note is that Republicans have been talking like this for years. Minion Death Cult (tagline “The World Is Ending. Your Uncle’s Facebook Feed Is Responsible. We’re Documenting it.”) have coined “Minion’s Law”, which is that right-wing comments on a news story will have at least one person calling for civil war.
Does this mean we are at zero risk for a second civil war? Of course not. But finding people online calling for civil war isn’t sufficient cause to be worried; there needs to be at least some evidence of mobilization, as there was leading up to January 6th (for instance).
Are you under the impression that claiming election fraud and presidential felony convictions are routine?
Well obviously presidential felony convictions aren’t. But election fraud? Sure, republicans have been claiming that to some degree or other for a long time. See for example the false claims that Trump would have won the popular vote if it weren’t for undocumented immigrants voting en masse.
In any case, the specific claim I was making was that calls for civil war on social media are routine. Maybe they’re more serious this time! But maybe look for concrete plans rather than vague threats.
I think it’s reasonable to be a bit worried considering the context: several seriously fucked up factors which are unprecedented. A coup attempt already happened, and now he’s been convicted of felonies after being “cheated out of the election”.
Yep it was similar during the Obama administration with conspiracies of many types that featured people talking about revolution and civil war.
How many insurrections happened during Obama’s term?
I didn’t notice any, but that’s not what we were talking about. The specific item of discussion was “calls for civil war” which we observed many of during the Obama term.
The human race is so dumb. We could be building spaceships and exploring the stars and the depths of the oceans. Instead we are being manipulated by propaganda to fight with each other while nefarious forces wrestle for power. This timeline sucks….
I’ve been thinking the same thing every day for the last 10 years or so…
David Bowie and Prince were holding this all together. When they went, the world lost its mind.
As a child of the 80s… yeah.
It sent me into a deep depression when everything revealed all at once how dire things really are. We had a lethal pandemic that killed MILLIONS of people become disputed, a meme and political slogan. We had a third of our people elect a literal stereotype of a con-man and try to overthrow the US Government to keep him in power, we’ve seen the return of nazis and sleazy pickup artists, we have people eating dangerous chemicals for social media attention, people deciding rules are no longer applicable to them, and it seems like anyone who babbles nonsense in a confident tone will gain a rabid cult following, while outside the world is literally starting to burn around us while people deny the very shape of our Earth.
And on top of all this, while people are struggling to find a path to truth and get through this, with any shred of belief in our potential and capability to rise above our worst natures, we now have a machine that can fool anyone into believing anything and it’s only getting more powerful, and it’s in the hands out-of-touch billionaires and mega-corporations and being distributed out to anyone who wants to use it for a small price.
We are but animals with fancy toys, and also not so fancy toys like cyber trucks, but you get my point.
Let’s start with housing? I’m all for exploration, but we don’t need 3 or 4 billionaires wasting resources, and innovation with non-compete contracts, when one central agency would be more efficient, freeing up resources to fix the logistics of feeding everyone, and housing everyone.
Sadly defunding of the space program has rarely meant funding proper welfare. It’s not really an either or situation, or at least it hasn’t been yet.
I don’t have an issue with space programs. NASA is great and the public gets a ton of useful tech from there. I doubt such discoveries will be provided by SpaceX and the like
I hope the country does reconstruction properly after Civil War II instead of coddling traitors and letting them put roughshod Confederate statues in town squares.
They didn’t put up the statues. Most of them specifically said to never make statues of them, such as both Jefferson Davis and Robert E. Lee. Woodrow Wilson wrote a good portion of “Southern Revisionist History,” using his Yale History Credentials, and ordered the erection of almost all those statues during his presidency.
I agree with the rest of your sentiment.
That’s because the US is under threat.
I mean… what did people think happens when the lies an empire is built upon is debunked one after the other?
You guys don’t understand, this time they’re double-super-mega-serious, not like all the other times these overly fearful ammosexuals talked a good game from behind their screens but completely failed to follow up in the real world.
Wait till they find out how hard it is to get a hair cut once “mobilized”.
They’re probable talking heads trying to spin up stuff to make forget that trump actually was convicted on a shitload of things.
And anger make you forget that, and maybe get you out and vote too …
IMO it’s programmed and a lot of bots.
Would we even notice if they followed through? From the people who brought you domestic terrorism its… more domestic terrorism.
Would we even notice if they followed through?
January 6th. Though that was massively helped by Trump preventing organizations from preparing beforehand and preventing action during.
