Wow you really don’t see what a shitty way of thinking this is, do you?
Which is why the vast majority of “safe spaces” explicitly and only for men, quickly devolve into incel shit.
Man fuck this mentality. The myth that if you put enough men together in one place that they will automatically start becoming toxic is the exact reason why men need safe spaces from people like you who spread this sort of hateful rhetoric.
The myth that if you put enough men together in one place that they will automatically start becoming toxic is
Not what I’m talking about about.
I’m saying men can just use the “default” ways to get help.
So while a “men only” safe space may start out beneficial, eventually more and more extreme views will be oresented. Which over time will drive off the normal men who started the community.
Because they still have default paths for help.
This concentrates the crazy, as more normals leave, it moves the tone of the space, which leads to either more normal men leaving, or staying and becoming radicalized.
And even the ones that leave later, are leaving a little worse than they showed up. They’re taking that change of tone back out in public. And effecting the default tone as well
I understand where you’re coming from, but you’re not thinking it all the way thru.
Good intentions, bad plans.
And this isn’t my hypothetical either, this is how most incel communities are created.
I’ll find a source and edit it in if you haven’t replied yet.
Edit:
I can’t find a source on it now.
But what I’m remembering was a discussion on how the literal r/mensrights sub became so radicalized.
It started out with decent normal men who were discussing things like custody rights.
But because they wanted it to be about men’s right and empowerment in general, they let people talk about other stuff. As more and more extremists showed up, the original members slowly left. It was a “frog boil” where those extremist views slowly became the default.
The more I think about it, the more I think it might be like a John Oliver or Jon Stewart segment and not an article.
But trying to search isn’t getting me anything, if I specify the sub in the search, I just get results from the sub about bullshit.
As far as I know, aren’t they just incels without Y chromosomes?
And probably the second best example for what I’m talking about with extremism taking over a “safe space”.
I’d assume it didn’t start out like that, but the more extremism was tolerated, the more prevealant it became and the more normal people left, concentrating the extremism until it dominated the community.
Considering everything in this thread I’ve said, why would you assume if I didn’t like one flavor of extremism I’d have to like the extremism of the other side?
Well, I suppose you’re more even-handed than I assumed. Usually when I pose this question I get hamstering on why FDS is fine whilst men shouldn’t be given spaces. It’s good to see someone have consistent views on the matter.
The problem really stems from men being given a strongly conflicted message of what ‘being a man’ means, particularly in the ‘default’ spaces. There is still a very strong undercurrent, at least in America, that men are supposed to be this strong, independent, stoic figure relying on themselves. Without a reinforcing support to acknowledge that asking for help is ok it’s easy to leave just as conflicted as one comes in.
Censoring opposing opinions isn’t an answer, but leaving them to their own devices in the public spaces is just as bad or worse. There needs to be a reconciliation between the warring perspectives if any kind of progress is going to happen.
Virtually everywhere else online as well…
But when your demographic’s safe space is literally everything that isn’t someone else’s safe space…
Doesn’t really feel like we need our own.
Which is why those places tend to end up as incel places.
“Men have been historically privileged, so therefore no man needs help” is basically the gist of this comment.
Nope
No man needs a special place for help, because they’re still considered the default.
Other groups get special places for help, because their rarer demographic comes with special issues most don’t face.
Which is why the vast majority of “safe spaces” explicitly and only for men, quickly devolve into incel shit.
Wow you really don’t see what a shitty way of thinking this is, do you?
Man fuck this mentality. The myth that if you put enough men together in one place that they will automatically start becoming toxic is the exact reason why men need safe spaces from people like you who spread this sort of hateful rhetoric.
Not what I’m talking about about.
I’m saying men can just use the “default” ways to get help.
So while a “men only” safe space may start out beneficial, eventually more and more extreme views will be oresented. Which over time will drive off the normal men who started the community.
Because they still have default paths for help.
This concentrates the crazy, as more normals leave, it moves the tone of the space, which leads to either more normal men leaving, or staying and becoming radicalized.
And even the ones that leave later, are leaving a little worse than they showed up. They’re taking that change of tone back out in public. And effecting the default tone as well
I understand where you’re coming from, but you’re not thinking it all the way thru.
Good intentions, bad plans.
And this isn’t my hypothetical either, this is how most incel communities are created.
I’ll find a source and edit it in if you haven’t replied yet.
Edit:
I can’t find a source on it now.
But what I’m remembering was a discussion on how the literal r/mensrights sub became so radicalized.
It started out with decent normal men who were discussing things like custody rights.
But because they wanted it to be about men’s right and empowerment in general, they let people talk about other stuff. As more and more extremists showed up, the original members slowly left. It was a “frog boil” where those extremist views slowly became the default.
The more I think about it, the more I think it might be like a John Oliver or Jon Stewart segment and not an article.
But trying to search isn’t getting me anything, if I specify the sub in the search, I just get results from the sub about bullshit.
So hopefully my explanation makes sense.
I’m sure you find no issue with FDS
The reddit sub femaledatingstrategy?
As far as I know, aren’t they just incels without Y chromosomes?
And probably the second best example for what I’m talking about with extremism taking over a “safe space”.
I’d assume it didn’t start out like that, but the more extremism was tolerated, the more prevealant it became and the more normal people left, concentrating the extremism until it dominated the community.
Considering everything in this thread I’ve said, why would you assume if I didn’t like one flavor of extremism I’d have to like the extremism of the other side?
Well, I suppose you’re more even-handed than I assumed. Usually when I pose this question I get hamstering on why FDS is fine whilst men shouldn’t be given spaces. It’s good to see someone have consistent views on the matter.
The vast majority of people would agree, so you may want to reevaluate the places you’re going online if your experience is different.
The problem really stems from men being given a strongly conflicted message of what ‘being a man’ means, particularly in the ‘default’ spaces. There is still a very strong undercurrent, at least in America, that men are supposed to be this strong, independent, stoic figure relying on themselves. Without a reinforcing support to acknowledge that asking for help is ok it’s easy to leave just as conflicted as one comes in.
Censoring opposing opinions isn’t an answer, but leaving them to their own devices in the public spaces is just as bad or worse. There needs to be a reconciliation between the warring perspectives if any kind of progress is going to happen.
I thought the suicide pandemic was just coincidence.
How about you take your soapboxing and fuck off with it somewhere else?