…
His intervention comes as the presidents of Brazil, Mexico and Colombia all called on Venezuela to release the full details of last Sunday’s election.
…
It has also attracted global criticism, with many governments around the world demanding the Venezuelan government release proof of the result.
The result has been recognised by Venezuelan allies China, Russia and Iran.
But, the US, European Union and other G7 countries have called on Mr Maduro’s government to release detailed voting data.
We also have overwhelming evidence Blinken has supported multiple coup attempts in Venezuela throughout his career.
Downvote actual facts if you like, you’re only showing your bias.
Mexico, Brazil, and Colombia are also asking for election data here, but you neglect to consider that.
You have this idea in your head that because you fully believe your news sources, that I am somehow in opposition to whatever your ideology on this issue is.
My goal is to point out that nothing western media or the US government has said or is saying is reliable on issues specifically concerning Venezuela, for at (the very) least the past three decades.
“I’m giving you a choice: either put on these glasses or start eatin’ that trash can.” ——-Nada, from the movie They Live.
Okay, and my point is regardless of if what you say is merited or not, Maduro can still have cheated.
Care to share that evidence?
I doubt you’ll read any of it but here is a random google search….
Details of a dozen or so coup attempts by us government
https://www.jstor.org/stable/j.ctv2tr51zb
Details of Blinken’s work history in the us government over this same period
Bias report on the jstor.org showing reporting credibility as factual and also detailing any of their bias etc
https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/jstore-daily/
If you believe western media and United States governments reporting on issues in Venezuela, you’re critical thinking ability is non existent.
If you believe every protest is a CIA backed coup attempt then nobody can help you.
According to Chapter VII of the United Nations Charter, only the UN Security Council has a mandate by the international community to apply sanctions (Article 41) that must be complied with by all UN member states(Article 2,2). source
Unilateral sanctions tend to destabilize economies causing protests.
This seems like it should be a response to someone else’s comment?
Absolutely, but if you were really interested in facts this information is not hard to find once you stop watching cable news…… I doubt you’ll read any of it but here is a random google search….
Your snark, arrogance and cynicism are unwarranted and inappropriate.
But I do appreciate your providing some info - I was genuinely curious and didn’t quite know where to find this evidence - initial searches did not turn up the kind of “overwhelming evidence” you claimed existed. I’m not for a second disputing the USA’s involvement in coup attempts or regime change in general - I think this is quite adequately documented. But your claim was that there is “…overwhelming evidence Blinken has supported multiple coup attempts” but the best you can do is to essentially say he’s guilty of this personally because he has worked for the US government.
That’s honestly pretty weak.
lol. You’re saying that without irony.
That’s not me being arrogant, I nailed it, I just did a slam dunk in your face after I alley-ooped my own pass.
And when your audience has zero critical thinking skills it’s probably the most appropriate time for cynicism.
Yes, I hate to break it to you but folks working for the leadership in the state department and national security of the us government are complicit in US backed coup attempts.
But your attempt to straw man my evidence is a sorry attempt to deflect from the actual fact that the United States and western media completely fabricate most everything anytime they open their lips to speak on issues concerning Venezuela.
That’s not me being arrogant, I nailed it, just did a slam dunk in your face after alley-ooped my own pass.
Not only arrogant, but cringe.
Sad to see “useful” idiots like you who probably don’t even know where Venezuela is, but as long as they are against the US they have to be good, right?
At least I’m useful. One day you’ll be there.
No. No you didn’t.
Ok weirdo
Do you see the vote counts? You suck here. How open minded and independently researched you clearly are.
A raging asshole who is right is still right, despite being a raging asshole.
Username checks out
Oh my what an amusing and original observation, one never before uttered in the history of the internet.
You waste your gifted prose on us my good person, please go find a country to be the Poet Laureate for, I am sure there are several waiting on your reply.
Thanks, you have a great username
Took me around four seconds to pick it.
I had intended it to be a warning so people aren’t disappointed in my sarcasm or shocked by my vitriol.
It hasn’t worked so far…
Don’t distract from the issue with whatabout-ism arguments.
lol. You’re arguing that Blinken trying to overthrow the Venezuelan government in the past is a whataboutism to any discussion of Blinken trying to do it again, right now even?
It would be laughable if it wasn’t so pathetic
Y’all cable news watchers use Orwellian talking points without a lick of irony. Wow
I don’t have any skin in this game, but what are the Orwellian talking points you refer to? I’m curious how this term is used and develops over time.
You’re suggesting the opposite of a thing is the thing, in this case it is Blinken having supported multiple coup attempts in Venezuela being a non relevant talking point to him currently supporting a coup in Venezuela
I would say “currently supporting another coup he supported last election” but nah, we’ve already established this is somewhere between his support of coups in Venezuela 12-15 times
Thanks for asking
Edit; it wasn’t you it was the other guy who was using the Orwellian double speak or whatever
He suggested that me mentioning blinkers previous support of coups in Venezuela during a discussion about blinkens support a a current coup attempt in Venezuela is a whataboutism or what not
If somebody losses the election and still rules, that person/party are there ones who made a coup. Opposing this statement can only mean you support any and all dictators as long as they role play as a democracy once every few years.
Ok Mr bot….
I’m going to wait until I see primary evidence, the US doesn’t have the most honest track records with South American countries
What are you talking about the US has never done anything bad in south America, unless you count Brazil, Argentina, Bolivia, ans Chile. Yeah the list is surprisingly short in south America.
Uh… Columbia??? Kind of a biggie to leave out!
I was using a list of coups. So I kinda forgot about the fuckery in Columbia.
Colombia*
Lol I’m sorry, I blame autocorrect but maybe just me being a dummy.I talk about the brand a lot more often than the country in my daily life.
Not just that, but it’s also that Anthony Blinken wrote Israeli propaganda articles since 80s.
If you like conspiracy theories, he may have been familiar to J Epstein, who may have had ties with Mossad (then that whole pedophile operation makes perfect sense as a very efficient way to blackmail a lot of powerful people, and him offing himself makes more sense).
If you don’t, the fact stands that Anthony Blinken has acted in the interests of a foreign fascist state since 80s.
This may be a bit philosophical, but South America in general has much more progressive approach to international law than the rest of the world, the Montevideo convention as the most notable example, but also the first country to recognize the Armenian Genocide was Uruguay, and despite all the dictatorships, crime and trafficking I’d say in some sense it’s still the least fascist part of the world.
In any case, who in their right mind really believes Maduro won? But I’m sure even Venezuelan opposition doesn’t want US to protect them Desert Storm style.
Yep
Maduro and buddies are already saying the post election protests were a CIA coup attempt. They knew this was coming and they tried to get out ahead of it.
How very cuntservative of him.
And plenty of useful idiots here are parroting him, because “US Bad”
And plenty of useful idiots here are parroting Blinken, because “US Good.”
“B-b-b-but whatabout” coming from one of the most ardent defenders of the fascist shithead Maduro here? How utterly predictable.
Media often reinforces binary thinking by presenting complex issues as battles between opposing sides, where there’s a hero and a villain, good guys and bad guys, with no room for middle ground.
This polarized storytelling simplifies narratives but doesn’t capture the complexities of real-life issues, which are often multifaceted and nuanced.
The US defines sanctions as acts of war, like economic warfare. So the US is at war with Venezuela. How can that fact not play a role in the evaluation of the claims? It’s like giving claims by Russia equal weight as claims from Ukraine about their own election.
And of course, how could you even expect free and fair elections while under siege?
And of course, how could you even expect free and fair elections while under siege?
Well, at least we agree they weren’t free nor fair. The difference is you believe US forced Maduro to falsify them because “US?” while some think he did because “Maduro”.
Well I believe the government had to clamp down on opposition because they actually are in league with the imperialist side of the US and want a coup and overthrow democracy in Venezuela. I don’t think they falsified the results, until I see actual evidence, and not just claims of having evidence by the lying US.
It’s similar to Iran: The guardian council was established to prevent coup attempts by e.g. the CIA. Election interference creates a legacy of problems. Many countries in the world can’t have a free democracy because the US can bring such a huge influence to bear. The USA deserve to be hated by many people of the earth. The US experienced that kind of interference the first time in 2016.
But my point is that if your country is under siege by a hostile foreign power you have to hold fast and prevent the take over at any cost. This is where crackdowns and oppression become less black and white and the use of force and violence is an imperative.
The Venezuelan government has been remarkably calm and measured though. They didn’t even arrest Juan Guaidó who clearly is a US puppet.
The US is bad. Especially when it comes to South America. And especially with socialist countries. The US always sanctions socialism to then claim it doesn’t work. Otherwise americans might start to doubt their ultra capitalism.
I think the venezuelan government is wrong this time, and the election was rigged, bUT: it coming from the US doesn’t mean shit.
It is sad that on any topic concerning South America, I am suspicious of anything that the US says.
What about Brazil, Mexico, and Colombia?
A distinctive objective take. Have a meaningless upvote.
The result has been recognised by Venezuelan allies China, Russia and Iran.
The three countries most well known for their open and fair democratic processes.
/s
Insert “Why is it always you three” meme here.
Sussy af
Blinken is possibly the worst Biden appointee
Can you elaborate? I mean I’m sure he’s a neoliberal jackass but they all are. Anything specific?
Lyin’ Blinken
2 things are true here:
- The US and Blinken are notoriously villainous bad faith actors
- Maduro is a fascist dictator
The best information I have seen says Maduro lost. I don’t know anything about the opposition party, maybe they would be worse for Venezuela, maybe not. It doesn’t seem like either party is acting in the best interest of the people, they’re stuck with having to choose which axis profits from their natural resources.
They can’t be worse. A dog could run that country better than Maduro.
US involvement makes this suspicious especially when it’s against a socialist candidate.
Why are these things always split across ideological línes? It’s obvious no one even looked at the results and are just cheering for their own team.
If it was US/Iran vs China/Germany then it would be much more interesting.
I’d say history. But it’s not even that. The US is at war with venezuela and always has been. Just kidding it’s eurasia. Nah haha but they are waging economic warfare. Well Trump did and Biden continues to.
So should you believe the US claims? You’ll have to as your ideological master programmer of course. It’s not like you could just use historical facts and make some clear logical deductions!
So yeah it’s ONLY a matter of ideology and opinion /s
Oh btw Trump also really won the last US election and Biden isn’t even President. It’s not like these things are different in any way - one side is right, the other is wrong, and it’s only a matter of opinion.
The US removed sanctions against Venezuela on condition that they would run fair elections. Of course they are involved, they need proof to know what to do with the sanctions.
All the more reasons america would want to manipulate the elections. If they stop their sanctions socialism could actually work and they cannot allow that.
Ocamm’s razor.
If they didn’t want to lift sanctions, they would just not lift them. If they did lift them, it’s because the US actually wanted fair elections. There’s not more to it.
None of this “overwhelming evidence” has been presented to the public. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Opinion polls don’t count for shit. Show me proof of a fixed election and I’ll believe you, but right now this entire thing stinks of the US not getting to control Venezuela and being really fucking mad about it.
I’m sure you’ve done tons of research into these claims and are certainly not just making a loud uninformed take
I’ve read a few articles. They’re all like, “we have sooooo much evidence that the election is rigged! Just so much!! But it goes to another school, so just trust me bro.”
I’m very happy to be proven wrong, if you have anything compelling to share, please do.
This is a story about it, I’d love to see the scans, where are they?
Edit: Never mind, another user shared the link.
Not everyone can have every expertise. You can dismiss a tally sheet written in crayon, but would you know an authentic one from a forgery? Some things have to be left to experts, like rocket scientists, nuclear engineers, and oncologists.
That is totally irrelevant. I specifically asked for the evidence, not for some journalist’s report on what some source said about how they got the evidence.
If you asked me for proof that Elon Musk tweeted something, I’d link you the tweet, not a report about how people are reacting to Elon’s tweet.
You can download the voter sheets that the opposition is presenting and investigate it yourself. Thankfully the AP already has (I trust them enough for this) and it indicates the government of Venezuela is lying
I know we’re not supposed to accuse others of being disingenuous actors on behalf of a criminal state, but it’s getting hard to believe this many supposedly well read people are so ignorant of what happened in Venezuela.
They’re not ignorant. They’re fascists cheering for their team.
People are quite rightly skeptical of mass media narratives. If presented with actual evidence you’ll find that people are willing to believe things. 99% of the coverage of the election in Venezuela has been spin from their political enemies.
They don’t. And they don’t need to! Being rude at people who disagree with the US State departments official position (which is not propaganda) is good enough, because propaganda = opinions that are not in line with the US state dept.
They believe that “fact” so powerfully that theyll get angry at you and insult you. Other facts become unnecessary if the person saying them is untrustworthy. Uncomfortable truths, any thoughts about the US’s many, many efforts to control the global south may be terminated along with the messenger.
Besides people use Ad hominem because it’s just so easy
Do you read what you have written and think, “yeah, that was a reasonable take?”
People are literally pointing this person toward the information they claim doesn’t exist. A few people were abrasive about it bc it comes up under an easy search. But they’ve ignored it, double down, and been dismissive.
Say what you want about the hive mind of Lemmy but be honest about this interaction.
Nobody pointed me towards anything until now and I literally immediately said “thank you” and amended my comment.
It literally does not come up after an easy search. Someone had to directly link me to a strange website that I’ve never heard of before so I could see the proof.
And you’re scolding people for being dishonest? lol
So what you are saying is that you have not been paying attention?
There’s no need to act like an asshole. I asked for proof, nothing more. Despite the dozens of people who downvoted me, only one was able to provide it, and it doesn’t show up on a Google search (due to the amount of blog spam about the topic, I suppose)
I haven’t seen that proof shared anywhere else. Have you? If so, where?
Last time I heard that argument it was from coked out pillow con man
o shit nice to see you again
Exactly. The opposition keeps saying they have proof but not revealing it. It’s all very Trumpian. They aid they have proof the election was fixed, too. I’m starting not to believe the US in this one.
I mean kinda me too…what I’m really afraid is that is foreshadowing November here
Oh damn, now you have me worried, too lol. I 100% bet Trump his team and their supporters will look to this election for lessons.
To be clear, I don’t think Maduro is a good guy at all, and he seems to be handling this terribly. But that only makes Venezuela easier to do this with, especially considering US interests in the region. (Insert Elon Musk’s “we can coup whoever we want” quote here.) Hopefully it all becomes clearer after the deadline Mexico, Brazil, and Colombia gave them to release full data and figure this out. Those 3 countries seem to be handling this the best by reaching out to both parties and handling this in a slow, calm manner. I’m trying to keep an open mind like them until then.
Thank you so much for being the only person to actually deliver what I asked for instead of some bullshit sermon. This looks legit. I will amend my original comment.
I already believe the Venezuelan elections were rigged. Stop trying to convince me otherwise Blinken.
I’m sure this had nothing to do with it.
People should question the USA every time they talk about South American countries. The same as how people question China or Russia when they talk about bordering countries. Super power will do what they can to influence other countries and historical and recent events make it clear that the USA is willing to lie and defend its lies. So people have the right to not believe the USA.
Wait, do you unironically think we want to annex Mexico?
Nothing in @Doorbook@lemmy.world’s comment implied that.
Also…Why do you think so many American cities in the south west have spanish names?
Nothing in @Doorbook@lemmy.world’s comment implied that.
You are a liar.
The same as how people question China or Russia when they talk about bordering countries.
Also…Why do you think
Not everyone is as bad a student of history as your peers.
That said, there are other regional countries which are also calling for data and are skeptical of the legitimacy.
Sure. When it’s appropriate. But it isn’t appropriate here. There are third party organizations with no love for the US also making statements about this.
Love the whataboutism. Top notch shillwork.
It’s not whataboutism, it’s good to look at the history and motivations of anyone making claims like election fraud. US officials are saying it’s fake, the US has a long history of South American political interference, especially if there is even a hint of socialism.
So you saw Maduro’s disaggregated numbers and they check out. Share them, please, everybody else wants to see them too.
I don’t think they are staying Maduro won. Polls showed this was going to be a landslide against him. Can’t trust polls especially in a dictatorship but I think there’s something there. I know in my heart he lost.
I thought Venezuela hasn’t had a legitimately elected government in a very long time. Was something different this time?
Chavez won, at least, his first election fairly and in a landslide. So, it’s been up to 25 years since the last free and fair election there.
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